brendan

Songwriter: Songs composed

2008-09-05T21:47:51.0012Z

The Lyricist type has the property “Lyrics Written.”

Some types, like Songwriter, are only used to classify topics, and have no properties of their own. We generally try to avoid them, but Songwriter was added to the system early on.

As I said in our earlier discussion, the notion of which compositions are songs and which are not is too subjective to easily divide. Many people regard Cage as a cutting-edge composer, and would consider calling his compositions “songs” dismissive. Rather than provoke edit wars, it is simpler to regard all musical compositions equally in Freebase.

Songwriter: Songs composed

2008-09-05T17:17:07.0012Z

Good morning, Cris, did you see my 3 wonderful philosophers on the front page today??

Sure, I can do that, but it is not nice to have empty spaces on the page. Look at Cage, please, what is the use of the "Songwriter" "Lyricist" boxes if we cannot put anything in them? It simply does not look good. Cage wrote songs...

Songwriter: Songs composed

2008-09-05T16:11:46.0012Z

He has the Songwriter type, which as I said before is a shorthand for both Composer and Lyricist. Songwriter has no properties of its own.

He also has the Composer type with several “Works Composed” already entered. You can add to that list.

Songwriter: Songs composed

2008-09-05T05:41:45.0012Z

... then why does John Cage have the "Song composer" type without anything on it??

Songwriter: Songs composed

2008-09-05T04:32:42.0012Z

Please use the “Works Composed” property of the Composer type.

Songwriter: Songs composed

2008-09-05T03:52:57.0018Z

Cris, please give us "Songs composed," I need it for John Cage. Thank you

Architectural contractor: Contracting firm

2008-09-05T00:25:55.0012Z

similar issues exists with other properties of /architecture/structure: architectural firm, engineering firm, architect, engineer. you're right. it's not well normalized. i like your idea of a mediator/role. I think what I'd like to do is keep the properties that I currently have on /architecture/structure

architectural firm
contractor
engineering firm

and have the expected type for each one be a different mediator type with a whole bunch of information about the role:

project
client
firm
start date
end date

perhaps, in the case of the contractor role there could be someone way of "tagging" the role as one of sub or general contractor. other properties could be added as needed: list of staff members and their roles? there is some question about how much detail we really need, as with it comes schema complexity. anyhow, any other thoughts on this?

Lindsay Lohan: Incorrect Wikipedia abstract

2008-09-04T00:28:01.0012Z

Thanks. This is a known issue that should get fixed in the next wikipedia cycle. Basically, Lindsay got her mom's name as a /wikipedia/en key somewhere along the way. This, plus a non-wikipedia derived topic for Dina, caused the topic updater to put the wrong blurb on Lindsay.

I'm patching the underlying data now; it should auto-resolve after the next cycle.

Lindsay Lohan: And Dina Lohan has no description

2008-09-03T23:18:40.0012Z

Cross-posting to Dina Lohan.

Lindsay Lohan: And Dina Lohan has no description

2008-09-03T23:17:30.0012Z

Thanks for noticing - we'll investigate

Lindsay Lohan: Incorrect Wikipedia abstract

2008-09-03T23:16:45.0012Z

Thanks for noticing - we'll investigate.

Lindsay Lohan: And Dina Lohan has no description

2008-09-03T22:22:10.0010Z

I just checked the mother's FB topic, and she has no Wikipedia abstract at all.

Lindsay Lohan: Incorrect Wikipedia abstract

2008-09-03T22:21:01.0005Z

The article from Wikipedia relates to Lindsay's mother, not Lindsay

Architecture firm: Projects not just structure type?

2008-09-02T10:53:33.0012Z

Agreed! Also, many times the design consultant is not the architect of record. An architecture firm might be working for the owner, or for the contractor, or even another architecture firm. The architectural consultant can provide many different services including things like interior design or specifications. Technically the master plan can include structures even if they are not yet built. However, there needs to be something more. I have been working on this myself. How do we edit this table? Paul Shanks

Architectural contractor: Contracting firm

2008-09-02T08:36:59.0018Z

I think the "architectural contractor" table should be a mediator - not a topic. A contractor is a role, not a company. This role requires a client, a project and a contracting firm. Also, a distinction is often made between the general contractor and sub contractors - neither fo which are architectural. Thoughts?

Craig Payne: Wanderlust

2008-09-02T05:58:28.0015Z

Wanderlust is Craig's 5th album and features 12 new original guitar instrumentals. The title track was written by Sir Paul McCartney and featured on the "Tug Of War" album in 1982.

Samples available on Myspace and at www.craigpaynemusic.com

Darkhorse: [silence] tracks?

2008-09-01T20:31:04.0012Z

See the blurb for the clue: "(Tracks 12 to 22 and 24 to 31 are blank)"

A practice by some musicians to 'hide' unlisted songs at the end of the CD play, particularly annoying when user only has an advance forwards/backwards buttons on the cd-player and there are dozens of silent tracks between the next to last and the "hidden" track.

Paris: Merge, don't delete

2008-08-31T17:58:34.0012Z

Don't delete!

Munich: Don't delete!

2008-08-31T15:59:03.0012Z

No way, don't delete!

Darkhorse: [silence] tracks?

2008-08-30T18:29:44.0005Z

How come there are multiple tracks named [silence]?

Conductor: Orchestras conducted

2008-08-30T10:53:22.0011Z

Cris, please, we need "Orchestras conducted." Thank you

Music: Concert Hall

2008-08-28T22:54:42.0001Z

Ok, thank you

Music: Concert Hall

2008-08-28T20:54:28.0012Z

Go ahead and create a type in your own domain, then, as a prototype. We have generally eschewed types in the Commons that have no properties, but it is possible that your type will evolve. I would recommend that you include Structure and Location in your type.

Music: Concert Hall

2008-08-28T20:13:33.0012Z

I am not thinking of any new properties, I only need the list at the moment

Music: Concert Hall

2008-08-28T19:25:00.0012Z

Take a look at Micah’s draft Performance Venue type and Robert’s draft Performance venue as well. A concert hall is a kind of performance venue; what additional properties would it need that these Performance venue types don’t have?

Music: Concert Hall

2008-08-28T17:47:05.0005Z

Cris,

we need the "Concert Hall" Type and a list of concert halls, please. There are practically hundreds of them in the world

Composer: Works composed

2008-08-28T00:07:15.0000Z

Why can't we have "Songwriter" with "Songs composed"? It makes sense and we need it

Actress: Musical artist is not the profession

2008-08-27T23:08:03.0012Z

already done.

Composer: Works composed

2008-08-27T20:21:08.0012Z

Currently, Songwriter has no properties of its own. It is a convenience type which includes Composer (with “Works composed”) and Lyricist (with “Lyrics written”), as well as Person (with all its properties).

Composer: Works composed

2008-08-27T19:13:40.0012Z

Alright, I see your point. So what do we have now?

Songwriter with Songs composed and

Composer with Works composed ?

If so, then everything is fine

Composer: Works composed

2008-08-27T18:39:57.0012Z

But Billy Joel has composed classical music. So has Paul McCartney. It doesn’t make sense to shoehorn their classical compositions into a song bucket just because most of their work has been songs.

Composer: Works composed

2008-08-27T17:58:30.0005Z

I did not mean to separate the songs from the works "within" the same composer! I wanted to keep Billy Joel and Schubert separately!!

"Songs composed" = Billy

"Works composed" = Schubert

That's why we need both categories

Composer: Arranger

2008-08-27T17:51:09.0012Z

That's correct, thank you!

Composer: Works composed

2008-08-27T17:41:55.0012Z

I disagree pretty strongly. Artistic judgments, particularly judgments of quality (when does a mere song rise to the level of composition?) are so very subjective as to invite edit wars. We have the Songwriter type with which a Composer can be co-typed if appropriate. But segregating the works—are Schubert’s Lieder songs, or compositions? And what about career songwriters like Billy Joel or Paul McCartney who start writing classical compositions late in life?

Composer: Arranger

2008-08-27T17:36:16.0005Z

I just edited the Yellow River Piano Concerto. It is now credited to the arranger, but also marked as an arragnement of the Yellow River Cantata, which has its own composer.

Composer: Works composed

2008-08-27T17:31:22.0012Z

Hey, this is fantastic! The truth is we need BOTH. There are composers who only write songs, for them is it good to have the "Songs composed" property.

Others write all sorts of things and for them we need the "Works composed."

One should have the choice between the two alternatives, use the one which is needed and let the other one obscured

Composer: Arranger

2008-08-27T17:24:17.0012Z

That's true, so what do we do, for example when a composer takes a cantata and makes it into a PIANO CONCERTO?? I just had this problem with Xian Xinghai who wrote the Yellow River Cantata, which was transformed by a Chinese pianist into the Yellow River Piano Concerto! Who does take the credit for the new composition? I think the "arranger," but at the moment there is no way how we can credit HIM. You, as a pianist, should care about this...

Composer: Arranger

2008-08-27T15:04:25.0012Z

I wrestled with this for a while before deciding the other way. Sometimes it’s very clear, as Grainger’s several arrangements of his setting of “Country Gardens.” However, sometimes it’s much blurrier; the folk song “Country Gardens” existed for centuries before Grainger did his definitive scoring of it. Consider also Jimi Hendrix’s arrangement of “The Star-Spangled Banner,” Coltrane’s “My Favorite Things,” or the notion that the 1812 Overture is an arrangement of “La Marseillaise” and the Russian national anthem. The Arrangement type makes the nature of the composition clear, but the creative rôle of the arranger is hard to limit so precisely.

Composer: Works composed

2008-08-27T14:59:38.0012Z

This is a good point. I’ve renamed the “Songs composed” property to “Works composed”; it already expected the Composition type but was poorly named.

Composer: Arranger

2008-08-27T06:13:40.0018Z

Some composers are good arrangers, again, one cannot mix their arrangements with their original compositions, that is a differernt category...

Composer: Works composed

2008-08-27T06:09:38.0006Z

A composer writes MORE than songs, e.g. symphonies, tone poems, chamber music, etc. There is no way one can mix these with songs together. Can we, please, have a special property for this?

Actress: Musical artist is not the profession

2008-08-27T05:11:56.0012Z

We will manually change the professions of the /people/persons with this profession to "Actor", and then delete the profession type from this topic.

Work Out Fine [VICL-60256]: Merge with "Work Out Fine"

2008-08-22T17:49:37.0017Z

The English-named tracks on this topic are translations of the romaji tracks on the other topic. Could be an American or European release, but it's almost surely the same album.

Musical Album: Catalog Numbers

2008-08-22T14:24:18.0012Z

The Release Event is a compound value type; the label and catalog number show up as apparent properties of Musical Release. The exact structure is only an issue if using the API.

The artist can change on reissues. For example, there is a single Billy Joel-branded release of what is actually two albums by two bands that he was in before he started his solo career. Same exact recordings, but different packaging and crediting. You are right that a re-recording is a new album.

Musical Album: Catalog Numbers

2008-08-22T13:58:26.0012Z

Hi crism...

Oh my. I'd found Musical Release but didn't go that far into "Release Event"...that's definitely pretty deep to have to go to put the catalog #. :)

Part of the goal is to let obsessive fans get in there and do the work of completing the catalog. But I'll have to get creative with the queries if it's this far away from "album"...

So if I'm going to be doing that: why is Artist on both Musical Album and Musical Release? Should it be allowed to change? If the artist is not the same, then wouldn't it have to be considered a new album? (If I re-recorded Sgt. Peppers, it shouldn't be considered a release of that album, should it?)

Musical Album: Catalog Numbers

2008-08-22T12:55:51.0005Z

An album can have multiple mixes which can be released multiple times in multiple countries. If your friend is this obsessive (-: s/he needs to go all the way down to the Release Event type, which is a particular release by a manufacturer in a region of a Musical Release of a Musical Album.

Musical Album: Catalog Numbers

2008-08-21T23:59:39.0018Z

Hi there, I'm working with someone who is trying to use Freebase as a semi-official database of their catalog. But one thing that seems to be missing is a place to put an album's catalog ID from the publisher (Kind of how books have "Book Edition"... with ISBN#s)

http://www.freebase.com/discuss/threads/guid/9202a8c04000641f80000000058694f9?domain=/book

Is there any place to put this information on an album?

Washington: us_state?

2008-08-21T23:40:12.0012Z

Yeah, I hear you. I was thinking of just an empty topic for use only with addresses. Ugly, but so is having DC missing from addresses. Maybe we should have a poll for which is worse :)

Washington: us_state?

2008-08-21T21:39:28.0012Z

That's going to cause some bizarreness in terms of data, since some of the data (like the properties on statistical region) apply equally to both the city and the district. To find out information about Washington, DC, users would have to know to look in two places. But I do see your point about the addresses. I'm not sure what the best solution is right now.

Washington: us_state?

2008-08-21T14:12:23.0012Z

I think we need to split this topic so we have "DC" to put as the state of a US address. (I get that it isn't a state, but it does belong in that field, just like PR.) It is odd because they are one and the same (I think?), but not sure how else to fill in addreses properly.